Does your state require Notarized signatures for vehicle title transfers?

[DealerEx]

Not required in Texas...it was for years, but finally did away with it sometime in the 90's

[57years]

NP required in KY and the big thing is it "scares" the begebius out of the girls in the office so they do not do non company signatures or titles. If we get an estate or divorce involved title, they make extra effort to be sure the proper party (with apprpriate authorization) is signing. I feel like it does protect the company's interest, although I doubt the NP requirement does anything outside a licensed dealer's building. If removed, I think titles would be less scrutinized and the process less self-protective for a legitimate dealer. My comment is worth what you paid for it!

[Lakeshow]

Required in MT, we have two on staff that we pay for renewals every five years. That way there is usually at least one in the building at most times.

[XDCX]

Originally Posted by DealerEx

Not required in Texas...it was for years, but finally did away with it sometime in the 90's

Thanks for the information - that's good to know.

I wonder if the New Car and Used Car Dealer Associations would support Arizona following Texas' lead and dropping the notary requirement?

On a side note, why were you posting to the forum after midnight? A little insomnia perhaps?

[XDCX]

Originally Posted by 57years

NP required in KY and the big thing is it "scares" the begebius out of the girls in the office so they do not do non company signatures or titles. If we get an estate or divorce involved title, they make extra effort to be sure the proper party (with apprpriate authorization) is signing. I feel like it does protect the company's interest, although I doubt the NP requirement does anything outside a licensed dealer's building. If removed, I think titles would be less scrutinized and the process less self-protective for a legitimate dealer. My comment is worth what you paid for it!

I value your opinion and thank you for providing it.

Maybe I'm jaded but the impression I get is the notary requirement gives the general public the image that the state has a firm grip on forgery/fraud but I doubt it makes any difference to the criminal element.

On a side note, I give you props for using the work "begebius" in your post - prior to today I don't think I've ever seen that word in print before. (I've said "begebius" before but I'm convinced I never would have been able to spell it.)

[57years]

My Dad said it so many times, I thought it was my middle name!!!

[DealerEx]

Originally Posted by XDCX

Thanks for the information - that's good to know.

I wonder if the New Car and Used Car Dealer Associations would support Arizona following Texas' lead and dropping the notary requirement?

On a side note, why were you posting to the forum after midnight? A little insomnia perhaps?

lol...nope, normal for me...just never slept much. I usually go to bed around 12:30 to 1:45am and wake up from 5:45 to 6:15am...haven't used an alarm clock in 20 years. back in my 20's and 30's I played in 2 poker games each week...one that I ran in a motel room on Teusday night that went from 7pm until 4am (i'd go home, sleep a couple of hours and be at work at 8am), and another big game at a ranch about 20 miles away. The ranch game started at 10pm on Friday night and sometimes ran until Monday morning...players from 100 mile radius. I'd play until daylight on Saturday, drive home, shower and shave and go to dealership until 2pm, go home, take a 2 hour nap and head back to game. Ahhhhh the stamina of youth!

[March88toDecember05]

Originally Posted by XDCX

Call me a skeptic, but I have a hard time seeing how Arizona's requirement for notarized signatures cuts down of fraud or forgery. In my eyes if someone's going to break the law by forging a signature they probably don't have an issue by taking the extra step and falsifying the notary stamp.

This thread got me thinking about the idea of a national, uniform title regime wherein instead of 50 states issuing titles, there would be a national systme in place. I think that this idea has been bandied by NADA and other associations off and on over the years to combat title fraud/salvage cars/odometer fraud, etc.

I believe that XDCX is right, if someone is inclined to break the law, a notary stamp is not going to stop him - I am not even sure that a nation system would be foolproof, but it surely would help.

I came across this web site during an Internet search on this subject. It is interesting and I did not even know that it existed until now. http://www.vehiclehistory.gov/

[XDCX]

Originally Posted by March88toDecember05

This thread got me thinking about the idea of a national, uniform title regime wherein instead of 50 states issuing titles, there would be a national systme in place. I think that this idea has been bandied by NADA and other associations off and on over the years to combat title fraud/salvage cars/odometer fraud, etc.

We are on exactly the same page.

While I hate big government I think vehicle titling is an example of a governmental process that would be much more efficient if it were handled on a Federal basis. I'd love to see all paper titles eliminated and go to a system like California has with electronic titles. (It's like paper checks, who uses those anymore?)

Title washing and vehicle cloning could be brought to an end if titles were issued on a Federal level.

Originally Posted by March88toDecember05

I came across this web site during an Internet search on this subject. It is interesting and I did not even know that it existed until now. http://www.vehiclehistory.gov/

I didn't know it existed either - I wonder if this is the same thing as the "Katrina Database" the government was going to maintain?

I also thought it was interesting to learn that dealers in California must run their used cars through the NMVTIS database before offering the vehicle for sale.

[WheelKinetics.com]

I know this topic is old, but since I'm an attorney and dealership owner, I tend to be a nerd on these things.

AZ MVD Policy 10.5.3.EE: Licensed Arizona dealers (or the dealer’s agents) are authorized to acknowledge signatures on title transactions for vehicles that are sold by or traded to the dealer.

AKA no notary is needed.

[XDCX]

Originally Posted by WheelKinetics.com

I know this topic is old, but since I'm an attorney and dealership owner, I tend to be a nerd on these things.

AZ MVD Policy 10.5.3.EE: Licensed Arizona dealers (or the dealer’s agents) are authorized to acknowledge signatures on title transactions for vehicles that are sold by or traded to the dealer.

AKA no notary is needed.

WheelKinetics.com - First post - Welcome to DealershipForum

Thanks for the information concerning the AZ MVD policy - I would have lost money on that bet. It was always my understanding that all title transaction in AZ had to be notarized - even if the transaction involved a dealership.

This is a great example of where I'm happy to be wrong. Thanks for taking the time to register with the site and correct my misunderstanding of the AZ title requirements.

On a different note, one of the coolest dealers I ever knew was an attorney. On occasion he'd lament that he hated attorneys even though he was one.....

[chryslersrt8]

A friend of mine who works for FEMA told me that a notary is one of the most lucrative jobs in Louisiana. She worked there assisting with Katrina a few years ago and said it slowed down the whole clean up process as each property couldn't just be handed down from generation to generation. It had to be notarized. Since most small, old properties were just handed down, the ownership proof slowed down dramatically, and many properties never got a help as a result.

[XDCX]

Originally Posted by chryslersrt8

A friend of mine who works for FEMA told me that a notary is one of the most lucrative jobs in Louisiana. She worked there assisting with Katrina a few years ago and said it slowed down the whole clean up process as each property couldn't just be handed down from generation to generation. It had to be notarized. Since most small, old properties were just handed down, the ownership proof slowed down dramatically, and many properties never got a help as a result.

Interesting example.

As before, I'm convinced that people who are inclined to steal or deceive are still going to do their evil deeds regardless of whether a notary is required as part of the process.
In my opinion the notary requirement is simply a bureaucratic process meant to give the illusion that government has procedures in place to catch people who intend to break the law.