A Trillion Here & There

[crowe]

A trillion here, a trillion there, pretty soon your talking about real money.

“The nonpartisan CBO, in an annual analysis of the White House budget proposal, said today that under Obama’s plan deficits would never shrink below 4 percent of the economy between now and 2020. The cumulative deficits would total $9.76 trillion, and debt held by the public would amount to 90 percent of the nation’s gross domestic product by 2020, the CBO said.”


http://www.bloomberg.com/apps/news?p...HvI9WH_Q&pos=8

[The StraightShooter]

We could easily be the next Greece but worse.

[Ralph]

Yeah...like next week.

[XDCX]

I finally had a chance to get caught up and read this thread. It really is depressing.

Spending in Washington D.C. is out of control and our relationship with Japan and China is certain to worsen in the coming years as they become less willing to fund our deficits by purchasing our debt.

While I'm no expert, my fear is the government is going to have to use inflation as a tool to reduce their debt exposure. It reminds me of the late 1970s when floorplan rates were above 18% and rates for auto loans were even higher.

What's worse, in my opinion, is the fact there are so many people on some form of public assistance it's getting almost impossible to vote the high spenders out of office.

[Txflyer]

Originally Posted by XDCX

What's worse, in my opinion, is the fact there are so many people on some form of public assistance it's getting almost impossible to vote the high spenders out of office.

That is the sad truth that we are faced with. Pretty soon those on entitlement programs will be deciding elections (if they aren't already). If we keep digging ourselves into a deeper and deeper hole, eventually we won't be able to reach the top to pull ourselves out.

[Ralph]

It's a purposeful intent to grind the economy down to a crawl and get more on the public dole. This enables, in theory, the government to come up with any wild ass program that they tout as a help, and those on the dole will support it. It hasn't worked that way yet, but that's the intent. The only way to bust capitalism is to slowly crush it by large unemployment, government moving into the private sector in the way of bailouts/ownership, create a gigantic vacuum where the only jobs are government jobs, and drain capital from the public sector.

[The StraightShooter]

What's crazy is the latest campaign against insurance companies. Now mind you I have little love for an industry that I've paid millions to over the years just to do business, BUT I highly doubt that they are the biggest problem facing this country. When you force companies like these to take on already sick people and then regulate what they can keep their premiums at that my friends is the beginning of the end for all private enterprise. Freedom? Niyet

[crowe]

I’m no fan of insurance companies either. But the focus seems to be on the insurance companies profits (profit is dirty word now a days). If you took all of their profit annually it would cover about 2 days national medical costs.

How does someone afford health insurance if they don’t have a job? The guy that has a job or business pays for it.

[possum]

It looks as though health "care" is passing, regardless of what people want. What will this mess do for the Auto Biz economies?

[XDCX]

Originally Posted by possum

It looks as though health "care" is passing, regardless of what people want. What will this mess do for the Auto Biz economies?

I've become so depressed regarding this issue I really have stopped paying attention. When I read about the $900 Billion cost figures my eyes just glaze over.

Concerning the car business, I haven't studied the issue close enough to comment intelligently. That said, I know the reason the UAW owns the majority of Chrysler is because they agreed to assume the VEBA liabilities. I wouldn't be surprised if the UAW came out smelling like a rose on this deal.

[Ralph]

I'm glad I wasn't able to convert my business to an "S" corp a few years ago. Anyone who is running their dealership and/or the land ownership under the dealership corp who shows more than I think I saw $250,000 has a big tax increase. For those who aren't sure what that means, if Joe Pelosi, (just a random name) owns Pelosi Chrysler and he makes $300,000 and the dealership makes another $200,000 Joe's personal tax return is $500,000. There's an added tax to pay for this mess on income over $250,000 that kicks in immediately to fund benefits that begin in 2014-2016.

So after 10 years of additional taxes and 5 years of additional benefits, wow, there's more tax money in than benefits out....sudden decrease in the spending. I wish I could use this kind of math at the dealership each year.

[Ralph]

That's 60 cents of every dollar over $250,000 additional tax my friends. Welcome to the Gulag.

[The StraightShooter]

What if you lost $250k last year because of the auto task force and their vision of the auto biz? Do I still gotta pay taxes? lol. Ugh

[possum]

As far as the sales biz goes, it seems like another hit to peoples disposable income. If, taxs and Ins premiums are going up 15%, there will be only one place to take up slack, and that is big ticket, or "toy" purchases.

Car biz will be hurt, but think of boats, RVs, lake houses, etc. This will cut back the peoples willingness to spend. People I talk to are just plain scared.

[DealerEx]

Originally Posted by possum

As far as the sales biz goes, it seems like another hit to peoples disposable income. If, taxs and Ins premiums are going up 15%, there will be only one place to take up slack, and that is big ticket, or "toy" purchases.

Car biz will be hurt, but think of boats, RVs, lake houses, etc. This will cut back the peoples willingness to spend. People I talk to are just plain scared.

In many areas of Texas, "real world" health insurance premiums went up MUCH more than the 15% maximum supposedly allowed. My brother who is retired from the engineering department of a statewide power company, whose division HQ is located in our town, just had his family premium go from $1456 per month in 2016, to $2572 for 2017. Previously they had 4 plans from the companies insurance carrier to choose from, but in 2017 they have only one option and one premium available. That is a real world increase of over 80% and he has no other option because if you have an available employer sponsored plan you aren't eligible to purchase coverage on the exchange. The plan I've been on for last 17 years, from a large regional hospital group, which allowed coverage from all our local doctors and our local hospital as well as their facilities, pulled out of the exchange this year and there is only one carrier offering coverage in this County. When we contacted our longtime carrier to see what comparable coverage to my previous Gold Plan we could purchase directly from them for my wife and I, it would have gone from $1389 to $2270...that's about 70% increase. I told the representative that was a huge increase, and she said "but you don't need to worry about it---your employer will be paying for most of it". I explained that I was self employed and would have to pay for all of it. She said the cheapest plane they could offer us as a self employed business would be $1568 a month for a plan with a $11,000 deductible, that allowed only one covered primary care physician visit per year and everything else, including prescriptions, is out of pocket until the $11,000 deductible has been met. That's not healthcare, but just extremely high priced catastrophic coverage. That same large regional hospital group, Scott & White, just merged 18 months ago with Baylor Medical, and they have gone on a building spree putting up multi billion dollar facilities all over the state as fast as they can acquire high end real estate to put them on. They are not doing that because they are losing money in the insurance business. Their affiliated doctors at their numerous clinics and hospitals are not allowed to accept Blue Cross Blue Shield of Texas insurance, which was our only option. I believe if the government is going to mandate coverage, then the exchange markets should be opened across state lines and allow all carriers to offer coverage in all markets so you have a true free market with competition. Otherwise you can wind up with a "monopoly" situation in some areas. 72 counties in Texas now have only one carrier offering insurance on the exchange--BCBS, and they no longer offer a PPO plan in Texas that allows you to access most doctors of your choice--they only offer HMO coverage now with a much smaller number of physician to choose from.